Tech Bindings: Do They Still Suck?

[BillyFromTheHills]

I was about to pull the trigger on a pair of Dynafits. I did a search and found recent incidents where they pre-released in potentially deadly terrain. This was the same problem they had in the early 90's when we used to scorn and ridicule Dynafit users. If it still happens, then they still suck. All the newbies to the sport seem to drool over their tech bindings. What gives?

[James]

It is not a question of if they will release in potential deadly terrain it is a matter of how often it happens and what your comfort level is with those odds. Any binding has a chance of releasing and most them have and in sometimes very bad situations. Tech bindings do it more. If you are careful to make sure they are on properly and lock them out when in no fall situations and perhaps dial down your skiing a bit I think most people are content with them. I have seen my son pop out of his verticals a couple of times and he was not all that happy about it. His Radicals have not come off yet but I think that might be partly because he is more careful when putting them on to make sure there is no ice and he double checks to make sure they are on properly. He is also more aware of their limitations and locks them out if it is really necessary.

I have yet to come out of my TTS toes and if I were to get an AT binding I would get Radicals but they are called Dynfiddles for a reason and just like other light weight gear there are trade offs. I think the newbies are more likely to be skiing a Marker or similar binding and the more seasoned skiers are on Dynafits.

[BillyFromTheHills]

Thanks, you mentioned "comfort level with those odds". I guess I'm trying to figure out those odds...

[James]

That is the real problem but I think there are enough people here to give you some feel. I am sure you know but the internet is a tough place to get reviews on gear. Anyone who has had a problem will post about it while those who are happy don't bother. I imagine you are familiar with MTBR.com. If you read the reviews there you would think every product was the best ever or completly sucked.

I think you have a very valid concern that is shared by most people who have used tech bindings. I know what I would do but could see how many people who really push the no fall terrain and or don't want to fiddle or double check things would make a different decision.

[Alex]

Everyone that I know that skis steep lines uses tech bindings. Pop the toe. In a no fall situation it doesn't really matter if it's your knee that releases, maybe then they'd have a bread crumb trail to find your body if you fell. In my opinion, it's the NTNs that are plagued with pre-release (into tour mode).
As James said though. Be watchful of ice build up in certain locations.

http://skisickness.com/post/vt533-26-apr-2014-chair-peak-ef-and-neb
One of many examples. I'm fairly certain Drew had tech bindings on... although he's been known to wear those strange switch-able toes that someone made in their garage (not the tele garage ones, the AT ones)

[NoPin]

Billy, I've been skiing the TLT Radical ST all season (~100 days) after skiing Fritschi bindings since the mid-80's. Skied the Dynafits in the backcountry as well as +25 days lift-served. The only time I've had a problem is when I neglected to lock the toes while skinning on steepish wind-crust sidehill. Never had a problem in hardpack/icy bumps. I think if I was skiing on true die-if-you-fall terrain I might lock the toes just to be on the safe side but, as I said, they have performed flawlessly so far.

I know, sample of one... but hope it helps.

Edited to add: I use Scarpa boots with genuine Dynafit tech inserts. I've heard that non-Dynafit inserts (Scott/Garmont/ect.) are not as predictable in their release.

[BillyFromTheHills]

Thanks Pin...not skiing in "certain death" terrain...just "phuck you up badly, perhaps die if unlucky" terrain.

[James]

Good phrases, we should have a scale.

Certain death
No fall
Perhaps die if unlucky
Phuck you up badly
Minor boo boos likely
Injury only to your ego
Get up quickly because you suck

[NoPin]

Another data point that might be of interest is that pretty much all the guides I know ski on Dynafits... in all terrain... none have complained about release problems.

[BillyFromTheHills]

^^^^Interesting....alot of the older guides I know won't touch them.

[Tele 'til You're Smelly]

In my opinion, it's the NTNs that are plagued with pre-release (into tour mode).

never had this happen when I used to tour with the Freerides; it happens with the Freedoms if you don't clean the snow out of the little triangle on the switchover- but if you do this it will not happen (yeah deskinning with skis on is a thing of the past, so there is that). And the ski stays on your feet even if it did happen- so not nearly as bad.

[Matt J]

I've only had warranted releases in Dynafits after a hundred days or so over the last two seasons.

I'd say the biggest "x" factor is probably the skier's size. I'd be a bit more concerned every pound over a couple bills. At 250 lbs. or so I'd probably just throw down and use the "beast." If you're really concerned the best thing would be to run the release setting (DIN equivalent) a little heavy on the heels and then lock the toes when it would matter.

I ski increasingly more conservatively the further I get from definitive care and encourage you to do the same regardless of the binding you choose.

[Quadzilla]

OK, Ive been on Dynafits for 7 years and like them so much for BC touring that I quit using telegear in the BC except for fishscaling. For me they are not fiddly and for the use I give them they don't have pre release problems. WTBS, you kinda need to be the right kind of skier to use them day in and day out without problems. If you are sloppy and just want to jam your foot into a binding and charge, then you will have problems, if you want to huck features grind stumps and rocks, you will have problems, if you want to charge at a resort on a regular basis, you will have problems. However, if you are the kind of skier who takes the time to learn how to use tech gear and learn the ABC's of the transitions and pretty much stay off resort snow, you will be rewarded with a reliable kit that is ultra light, ski any BC terrain and way less effort on the up compared to anything else. For me, if I was comparing my latest tech setup to my last trad tele setup, I would gain one full lap on the up as compared with less energy.

As far as the down, if you are a proficient fixed heel skier, no learning curve. They do release, sort of? For the first three years I always skied them with the toe locked. Tele skier I am used to my skis not coming off. The past few years, I run the toes in ski mode with release. I have only had one fall where the skis came off and that was when I was being towed behind a snow cat and my foot got tangled up in the rope, ski popped off and all was good. Bottomline for me, I rarely fall and never yardsale so with all the time on tech no real confidence of exactly the release point. I am sure in a AVY with all that force, they would come off like when I got the rope around my foot. A slow twisting fall? who knows.

My wife likes them as well, for the up and lack of weight.

IMO, tech gear is only great if the whole kit is built light weigh. Seems pretty stupid to have Dynafits on a heavy resort clunker and big heavy four buckle boots that might have tech toes.

[James]

This is very well said.

For me they are not fiddly and for the use I give them they don't have pre release problems. WTBS, you kinda need to be the right kind of skier to use them day in and day out without problems. If you are sloppy and just want to jam your foot into a binding and charge, then you will have problems, if you want to huck features grind stumps and rocks, you will have problems, if you want to charge at a resort on a regular basis, you will have problems. However, if you are the kind of skier who takes the time to learn how to use tech gear and learn the ABC's of the transitions and pretty much stay off resort snow, you will be rewarded with a reliable kit that is ultra light, ski any BC terrain and way less effort on the up compared to anything else.

As far as Freedoms going in to tour mode I have already said I don't think I would own them if I lived in SW BC.

[Alex]

never had this happen when I used to tour with the Freerides; it happens with the Freedoms if you don't clean the snow out of the little triangle on the switchover- but if you do this it will not happen (yeah deskinning with skis on is a thing of the past, so there is that). And the ski stays on your feet even if it did happen- so not nearly as bad.

I'm pretty thorough when I click snow and ice out of any of my bindings. But I did have the Freedoms release on me in a bad place. But as James said, SWBC can have some sticky snow. What worried me about the Freedoms was that it appeared to be completely free of snow and ice, yet still released - even after thorough cleaning.

I trust TTS before I trust NTN. So the tech toe is solid. However, Dynafit pre-release can also come from not properly setting your bindings and not having enough of a space at the heal. That's why there are many new bindings with a spring in the heal piece to allow for fore/aft movement (which want no space). This is a reasonably new feature, so if you don't want to play guinea pig, then go with the tried and true.