Earning Your Turns Skinning Tips

[Quadzilla]

OK, first of all I lifted this vid from Lou Dawson and Wild Snow. My bad... However, it is a good short tutorial on skinning tips and fundimentals. So, as you become addicted to skiing powder all the time you will quickly learn that the only way to do this is to hike for it.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LmzA...layer_embedded

[dschane]

And our host has several blog posts on this matter: http://www.earnyourturns.com/categor...ique/skinning/

There was one that I thought was also from the Dosin8tr, but I cannot find it -- it was about modestly snapping your outside foot forward and then back when making sharp turns on the skin track. It was helpful.

[yersinlepoleAunt]

OK, first of all I lifted this vid from Lou Dawson and Wild Snow. My bad... However, it is a good short tutorial on skinning tips and fundimentals. So, as you become addicted to skiing powder all the time you will quickly learn that the only way to do this is to hike for it.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LmzA...layer_embedded

Wow, that nice guy has big ears !! Waxing skins..should we also cork and scrape them after waxing ?
Seems like an nice guy ..Cool coat, just like my new one..Aaron liked my old coat better..
I wonder if AaronWright is now Aaron77 ? Well, anyways, happy skinning!

[Dostie]

And our host has several blog posts on this matter: http://www.earnyourturns.com/categor...ique/skinning/

There was one that I thought was also from the Dosin8tr, but I cannot find it -- it was about modestly snapping your outside foot forward and then back when making sharp turns on the skin track. It was helpful.

Not sure if this was what you're referring to: Step-Down Kick Turn (I don't think so)

Or this: Kick Turns on Steep Terrain

From my (mis)understanding of your words, neither. I think you're refering to what I call a pivot kick-turn. Do advise and I'll try to find 'er for easy reference. Or maybe I need to finish editing something I referenced in one of those articles.

[dschane]

Not sure if this was what you're referring to: Step-Down Kick Turn (I don't think so)

Or this: Kick Turns on Steep Terrain

From my (mis)understanding of your words, neither. I think you're refering to what I call a pivot kick-turn. Do advise and I'll try to find 'er for easy reference. Or maybe I need to finish editing something I referenced in one of those articles.

Okay, so my brief explanation was rather pathetic, but the Kick Turns on Steep Terrain is the vid that I was thinking of. Thanks! And I believe I have the award for the least flexible guy in Juneau, so that step down method is probably worth adding to the bag of tricks.

[meadowskipper]

steep/tight kick turns, imo, mean that the skinner is too steep and should've been put in differently in some way, shape, or form. taken a different route/approach.

[Greg]

I find it useful when making step kick turns to slide the tail of the first-pivot-ski under the other ski. This is much easier when you do not have twin tip skis, so I prefer skis with flat tails. Having tail attachments on your skins is also handy when doing this.

[dewam]

steep/tight kick turns, imo, mean that the skinner is too steep and should've been put in differently in some way, shape, or form. But lets face it, if there was a more efficient way, someone would have found it. On this hill steep/tight kick turns is still the best way up. I'll keep looking though, that third lap is getting mighty tough.

[Baaahb]

steep/tight kick turns, imo, mean that the skinner is too steep and should've been put in differently in some way, shape, or form. taken a different route/approach.

AMEN TO THAT! My pet peeve is skin tracks that are too steep. But I guess I can agree with whomever sets them on one thing....if you want something done right, you have to do it yourself....

[Dostie]

steep/tight kick turns, imo, mean that the skinner is too steep and should've been put in differently in some way, shape, or form. But lets face it, if there was a more efficient way, someone would have found it. On this hill steep/tight kick turns is still the best way up. I'll keep looking though, that third lap is getting mighty tough.

Depending on how big the climb is, if the 3rd lap is getting tough then either the skinner is out of shape, or the track is too steep. If the track is too steep, ANY kick turn will be tough because you need to expend so much energy holding on while switching direction.

If done correctly, a tight switchback results from a low-angle skin track. This requires more skill/technique to pull off, but less energy. The answer, as I have tried to convince the stubborn is to stop skinning so steeply and learn some uphill techniques to make the climb more efficient - especially if you're doing multiple laps. The only way I know to convince someone of this FACT is through experience, and with a coach (me) who relentlessly whips those who climb too steeply, and patiently instructs in the nuances of a tight switchback (snap kick-turn). Until then, I'll simply quote Arnold "hear me now and believe me later."

Okay, bring on the debaters. You might think you're more of a man if you can skin straight up, but I know that in the long run (I'm talking decades of skinning, or tens-of-thousands of vert-per-day) the low angle track is best. Even Andrew McLean (AT Apostle) is on record that for efficiency, around 15 degrees is optimal.

[dschane]

steep/tight kick turns, imo, mean that the skinner is too steep and should've been put in differently in some way, shape, or form. taken a different route/approach.

I generally agree. However, while many routes may be manageable with a reasonable degree on the skin track, often as we get close to the top, some routes choke up, and you have two options: take the skis off and boot pack it up, or go for a steep skin track. Assuming the consequences of a slip or fall are minor, I'll give the skins a go, esp. if the boot pack involves 18-inch post-holing.

[televisionary]

Okay, bring on the debaters. You might think you're more of a man if you can skin straight up, but I know that in the long run (I'm talking decades of skinning, or tens-of-thousands of vert-per-day) the low angle track is best. Even Andrew McLean (AT Apostle) is on record that for efficiency, around 15 degrees is optimal.

I think that would be out of sequence for a new discussion board like this. Tradition calls for a good AT vs. tele smack-down before we get into it over this topic.

But, if we must, then I think the optimal angle has a lot to do with the skinner's physical condition and skill, the terrain and snow, and the amount of vertical to be covered. I've never measured the angle of tracks, but I like to take a track that's as steep as I can comfortably go, which is pretty subjective.

[tele.skier]

I think that would be out of sequence for a new discussion board like this. Tradition calls for a good AT vs. tele smack-down before we get into it over this topic.

But, if we must, then I think the optimal angle has a lot to do with the skinner's physical condition and skill, the terrain and snow, and the amount of vertical to be covered. I've never measured the angle of tracks, but I like to take a track that's as steep as I can comfortably go, which is pretty subjective.

Ditto,.. with lower angle climbing I don't bonk, nor have trouble regulating my pace, but at higher angle climbing, I have to be more careful how fast I go or I bonk. I think how steep a person can go is related to each person's conditioning..

I am a bigger fan of lower angle skin tracks just because I don't have to focus on regulating my pace so much and I can just enjoy the hike up more, and have some legs and lungs left for the fun part...

[dewam]

ap kick-turn). (I'm talking decades of skinning, or tens-of-thousands of vert-per-day)

I also have decades of skinning, but have never made tens-of thousands of vert per day, and at my age I never expect to. The hill in question comes in at just over 6k with the third lap. If I want to ski this hill in a relatively safe manner it requires pitches of steep and tight on the up track, or an extra couple miles around. I am over 60, I fully understand the need for efficiency. Sometimes, if you want to ski the hill, there is just not an "efficient" way up. I would love to find a more efficient route, like I said, that third lap is getting tough.

[Greg]

Re optimal track steepness, my pet peeve is this. When breaking trail on a pair of BD Gigawatts or DPS Lotus with wall-to-wall skins, you get traction aplenty. So, trail breakers tend to put in really steep tracks. But, once the track gets set in and iced over a bit, the reduction in traction makes skinning a line that steep hard. Especially if the followers are not on massive skis and wall-to-wall skins. So, when breaking trail, it is best to go a bit less steep than you can.