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  • 22D spy shot

    Josh Madsen posted this photo with the caption:

    "Came across this little nugget on the internet via 22 Designs. Looks like something new is cooking. What do you think it is?"

    Click image for larger version

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  • #2
    I suggested that it's a 3d printer in need of different retraction settings. And that it looks like the heel pad & "key" they use on their other bindings. And it also resembles the Kreuzspitze heel pad that allows you to mount an AT heel piece. Might 22 Designs be dipping their toe into the dark side??

    The answer I got was "Don't think the dark side."

    It kinda looks like some sorta crampon hook, or maybe some kinda module for attaching and detaching the back half of an NTN binding?

    Where else can 22D go, really? They already make a burly resort-minded binding, and a light-ish 2-pin touring-minded binding. Doubtful they're doing anything non-NTN/TTN. Maybe something even lighter? Maybe a simpler resort binding with no tour mode?

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    • #3
      Looks like 6 hole mount toe to mount a tech toe and a block for the heel spring throw.

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      • #4
        I agree with BTS, what i think it is is evidence that 22D needs to spend time learning how to setup their slicer. those parts are ugly.

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        • #5
          I'll go with a plastic version of the Lynx that drops 400g per binding.

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          • #6
            I kinda like the lightweight Lynx fantasy, which would build on a binding that already is in production, with the kinks worked out in the first couple of versions.

            I don't see a reason why 22Designs would get into the OMG-style TTS market with spring mechanism hooking to the real heel. Is that market big enough for Voile and OMG and Moonlight and 22Designs as well? And even if it is, why would they compete with the Lynx? The only boots on the market suited for the TTS style design have the duck-butt - no more bellowed F1's or F3's - and presumably there's a duck-butt on the long-rumored new Scarpas. So anyone looking for an NTN touring binding could use the Lynx (or a fantasy lightweight version).
            Last edited by ts01; 31 December 2020, 08:08 AM.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by jasonq View Post
              ...22D needs to spend time learning how to setup their slicer. those parts are ugly.
              That's to throw you off the trail.

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              • #8
                22designs are now printing parts in "sharp cheddar"
                the fall line is your friend.... resistance is futile

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by ts01 View Post
                  I kinda like the lightweight Lynx fantasy, which would build on a binding that already is in production, with the kinks worked out in the first couple of versions.

                  I don't see a reason why 22Designs would get into the OMG-style TTS market with spring mechanism hooking to the real heel. Is that market big enough for Voile and OMG and Moonlight and 22Designs as well? And even if it is, why would they compete with the Lynx? The only boots on the market suited for the TTS style design have the duck-butt - no more bellowed F1's or F3's - and presumably there's a duck-butt on the long-rumored new Scarpas. So anyone looking for an NTN touring binding could use the Lynx (or a fantasy lightweight version).
                  My Skimo binding uses a flex plate and a heel cable, although set up for F1, it works even better with TXP. It is slightly lighter than a Lynx, and could be perhaps up to 100g less with more work and £££s. Not having a complex butt claw, there is less to go wrong. The plate to can be simple and reliable. In the next iteration it would have a more narrow plate, so reduce any snow packing issues. It only relies on the toe for boot to binding connection, though this is more than good enough for a light ski.

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                  • #10
                    I was seeing something like this. But the 4 lower holes on the 3D print look like they're in a pretty square pattern, and most heel pieces out there use a pattern that's a bit more elongated fore-aft.

                    Click image for larger version

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                    The idea of a lighter/ simpler Lynx isn't that far-fetched. Think about how much engineering has gone into making NTN binding claws move out & around the boot's duckbutt so they can latch on. Freedom/Freeride especially, but Outlaw & Lynx too. Bishop said nah let's skip it altogether.

                    Then M Equipment showed that with some smartly placed ramps, you can just use the main springs' preload to do the job. They don't get enough credit for this. I don't know where things stand with patents and all that, but it's kinda opened the door for NTN bindings to be a lot simpler. It wouldn't surprise me if 22D were going down that road, both for a straight ahead resort binding and for some kinda ultralight touring rig.

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                    • #11
                      Did I hear on a podcast that 22 designs had been thinking about retractable ski brakes?
                      Like an Outlaw without a tour mode but with a more functional ski brake.
                      Let’s call it the In-law😁: easier step-in, lighter, cheaper... spread Telemark!

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                      • #12
                        Yup, seems totally logical to me. When brakes are outlawed, only Outlaws will have brakes.

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                        • #13
                          I was going to go with a design for either brakes or a flex plate. The piece on the left looks like it slots under the piece on the right. The piece on the right looks like a toe plate with width and lengthwise slots underneath -- widthwise to let the brakes poke through, lengthwise for the lever that your toe holds down. So, I think the piece on the left is a filler for the toe plate when the brakes are not in place.

                          If it is a toe plate, it doesn't look like it's for the Lynx. But, like ts01 said, I don't think 22 would fragment their market further with another tech toe. Would they make such a major redesign to to the Lynx now? That's a head scratcher.

                          Also, the 3D printing issues look like an unsupported bridge problem to me.

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                          • #14
                            Maybe it’s for the outlaw without free pivot. So downhillers ntn crowd can get a lighter binding. Kinda like the Vice.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by jtb View Post
                              I was going to go with a design for either brakes or a flex plate. The piece on the left looks like it slots under the piece on the right. The piece on the right looks like a toe plate with width and lengthwise slots underneath -- widthwise to let the brakes poke through, lengthwise for the lever that your toe holds down. So, I think the piece on the left is a filler for the toe plate when the brakes are not in place.
                              I think you're on to something here, especially with regard to brakes. The problem with the Outlaw is the brakes. They don't retract enough and make stepping in more of a fiddle fest. But if the brakes were recessed under the toe cage, as the above image and jtb's insight suggest, then it would be easy to step in to and the brakes might be configured to lift and retract like alpine bindings. And the space that requires may be available if the free-pivot switch weren't needed. Pure speculation standing on the shoulders of everyone else's ideas.


                              ain't no turn like tele!

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