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Meidjo 3 - how does it work?

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  • #16
    I made my "just use a low heel riser" comment half in jest, but after taking some measurements, I'm convinced it is absolutely a viable solution (if not THE solution). Measuring on my Meidjo 2.1's, it would require ~26mm of heel lift to make the duckbutt not hit the top of the claw. Maybe a tad more to account for boot flex.

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    Then I measured some race-style skimo heel pieces, ones used by racers for maximum efficiency on all grades, including flats. 26mm above the normal downhill position.

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    If 26mm is good for folks whose livelihood depends on being as efficient as possible, it should be good for folks out having fun. Of course skimo race boots have oodles more rearward ROM than current stock TX Pros; only having 2 degrees or whatever will force you uncomfortably forward on the flats. I get the need to sell a product that is compatible with what's currently on the market, but with the forthcoming Scarpa touring boots -- and the DIYers out there -- a heel lifter-based solution (including a cavity-free springbox) should work fine. It would make the Meidjos simpler, lighter, better-performing, less prone to breakage, and maybe even cheaper. Perhaps Pierre already has something ready to go for when this happens.
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    • #17
      maybe not the lightest weight, but you could look at this the other way too, at least with 3.0

      a riser under the toe, which should be ~1/2 of 26mm due to the angles and the duck butt being about 1/2 to the heel. Then the same amount added to a heel pad. Now the trick. One of two things needs to be added. Either something like the top of the heel pad flipping back, removing that extra riser, so you can now step down into the binding, then flip the pad back to full "skiing" height. To tour, just exit the binding, click back into the toe, but leave the heel pad at skiing height so you can't step into the claw. Or have a post like thing under the claw to step down on, and to tour, step out, remove/swing the tower out of the way to prevent stepping into the claw, click into the toe.

      both these options mean no red stick of death, so that entire bottom can be filled and anti ice taped. And both may mean less icing during skiing due to having a large gap between the claw and ski (in one case the tower will be there, but it can be a pyramid). And both may mean less claw packing during touring.

      I'm getting 3.0's and plan to try the above. and that riser mean i don't have to drill a bizzillon new holes in my skis, probably just 2.

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      • #18
        I'm with you guys on the heel riser idea, if you're always climbing in tour mode. I'm not so sure about the toe riser though. Are you thinking of raising the spring box pivot point as well? If yes, then you'll have a problem with step-in because the spring box would sit at a negative angle on the ski. If no, then you'll change the flex and release dynamics, because the spring box would have a positive angle relative to the duck butt when the boot is flat. I'm all for experimentation, but given the level of engineering that went into Meidjo, I would worry about changing the dynamics of the binding.

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        • #19
          OK, thinking about it more, what about this: Raise the heel and toe 13mm, and have a 13mm spacer on a pivot that sits under the spring box. In downhill mode, it raises the spring box to keep it level with the heel/toe. In tour mode, you flip the spacer back so it sits on top of the heel. Now the spring box sits at a negative angle on the ski (13mm lower), and the heel is 13mm higher.

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          • #20
            I like that last solution, jtb . Perhaps there could be a wire lifter embedded in the flipped-back spacer, so folks who want more than 13mm of heel lift can go higher. But I'd think 13mm would be good enough for the flats, even in boots with suboptimal ROM.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by jtb View Post
              OK, thinking about it more, what about this: Raise the heel and toe 13mm, and have a 13mm spacer on a pivot that sits under the spring box. In downhill mode, it raises the spring box to keep it level with the heel/toe. In tour mode, you flip the spacer back so it sits on top of the heel. Now the spring box sits at a negative angle on the ski (13mm lower), and the heel is 13mm higher.
              that is really close to what i was talking about, but i was thinking 13mm heel and toe. And then flipping forward the top 13mm of the heel pad to set step down on. The claw and toe will be "level" at that point so step in is as designed on the 3.0. And then flipping it back to ski. To tour, just clip into the toe. this gives you a flat tour mode option. there would still be a elevator wire or wires like normal.

              for your concept, what i like is that you don't actually need the full 13mm of rise at the toe since you will have some extra rise at the heel due to the mini-elevator. at least if you are willing to have a slight down angle during step in (same but a lesser extent with my concept). That would allow for a lighter weight due to less rise-y riser.

              I have also thought about attaching what amounts to the same thing onto the claw using those two plastite screws holding the release spring cover, and have it flip up between the springs for tour, or down below the claw for step in.

              I have also thought of 13mm heel and toe, and a 13mm claw pad that rotates around the heel pad. downhill, rotate it forward, step into the claw. at that point you can leave it, or rotate it back. tour mode, just leave it rotated behind the heel pad.

              And i have also thought of instead, just have the entire heel pad slide back/rotate/flip back/whatever so the heel can go to the ski surface for for step in, so to claw hits the ski during step in, and just have that down angle during step in. What i don't like about that is it might take extra ankle flex to step in. don't know until i try.

              but all are variations on the same concept. Just get the claw below the duckbutt in tour mode. And have it higher for step in. I happen to think this is a good idea as it means you can elimnate all sorts of nook and crannies with the red stick of death, and that extra room under the claw will mean snow doesn't pack as dense so shouldn't accumulate so much, compact into ice as easily, and be easier to clear.

              And the drawback is weight due to the risers.

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